do dive into something and treat it as an experiment.

Like, you don't have to just like pinball around

or not know what to do, like pick something and dive into it,

but take to it as what am I going to learn about myself

from this and let that inform your next pivot.

Hello and welcome to the Psychology Podcast.

Today we welcome David Epstein to the show.

David is the author of the number one New York Times bestseller,

Range, why Generalist Triumph in a specialized world.

And he also wrote the bestseller of the sports gene.

Both of these books have been translated

into more than 20 languages.

His TED talks on performance science

have been viewed more than 11 million times.

David has a master's degree in environmental science

and journalism and has worked as an investigative reporter

for pro-publica and as he's also a senior writer

for sports illustrated.

In this episode, I talk to David about greatness.

This is a topic of mutual interest of ours.

You know, if there's one thing we know for sure about greatness,

it's that there is no linear path to it.

...