Gahy humans. Welcome to the safe space for dangerous ideas. One of the most fascinating books that I've read about the experience of an American moving to Australia, comparing the two cultures, comparing the upsides and downsides of each and sort of taking some lessons from America to Australia and vice versa, is a book called Into the Rip.

That's its name in Australia.

The American publication is called Parenting Like an Australian One Family's Quest to Fight Fear and Dive into a Better, Braver Life.

You've got to love those subtitles that the publishers make you put on your

books. There you go. It's basically about what today's guest, Damien Cave, learned about

the Australian culture by his involvement in what's called Nippers, which is where we train young

Australians to get good at beach sports and swimming and life-saving and so on. And Damien threw

himself into this

as well. He was coming to Australia as in order to set up the New York Times Bureau in Australia.

And he's been the bureau chief of the New York Times ever since. We touch a little bit about

his thoughts on the fate of the mainstream legacy media and the sort of great awokening of 2020 and what went

down at the Grey Lady, the Great Masked, during that period of time. But really Damien is

most interesting in his cultural and political observations about what sustains good society and a happy

thriving culture. Damien has been a bureau chief and global affairs correspondent for

the New York Times from all over the world. He has a tremendous pedigree. He was part of a team of

finalists for the pull at surprise, thanks to his work on the war in Iraq. I hope you enjoy as much

as I did, the one, the only Damien Cave.. We both have connections to Worcester.

How would you define Worcester, for people who don't know, Worcester, Massachusetts?

You know, sometimes I describe Worcester as this industrial city that peaked more than 100 years ago

and has been struggling to reclaim its glory ever since.

That sounds so romantic. Yeah, it's, you know, the American comedian Dennis Leary, who, you know, swears a lot and is a bit bitter but also very funny, grew up in the same neighborhood as me. And so that's also what I tell people is that if you have, if you understand Dennis theory's sensibility, you understand where I gain fun. Yeah, it was. And about, so we were just saying that, you know, in sort of 2012, I had just moved back

to New York from Los Angeles and joined Huff Post when they were trying to do to television

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