This podcast is brought to you by sarahraven.com, which is home to everything you need for a truly

beautiful and productive garden. You'll also find great and essential gardening kit and stylish,

lovely things to have in your house to bring the outside indoors, all inspired by the garden

and the house being tied together. There's also plenty of

garden inspiration, how-to videos and specialist growing guides. So head over to sarahraban.com today

to discover even more. Welcome to Grow Cookie to Range, the podcasts of me, Sarah Raven, and various different guests.

And today, I'm actually joined by two very distinguished gentlemen.

One is my husband, Adam Nicholson, and the other is Steve Head.

Basically, he runs something called the Wildlife Gardening Forum. And he is a sort of biodiversity

expert, I guess, but very, very much with the garden at his heart. He knows more than anyone

I've come across about how we can make our own little

patches, not just good for us and lovely to be in, but also good for biodiversity.

Welcome, Steve. Hello. Nice to be with you, Sarah. And welcome, Adam. Thank you for having me.

So how we thought we'd do, we're going to do a pair of podcasts.

And the first one, I'm going to lead, and Adam might interject, and that's going to be on, with Steve, on gardening and biodiversity.

And the second one, Adam's going to lead, and I might interject, I might not,

and that's going to be on the importance of ponds. And they go together these two, and Steve's

going to be with us for both, because Adam, the reason I want him to lead it is that he's actually

on the farm putting ponds in. And one of the things I'm sure we'll touch on in the gardening section

with Steve is how unbelievably important even just a bird bath or a shallow saucer literally

for insects to be able to drink in without drowning is and then taking it in and Adam will take it

on to ponds either large or small and how

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