Bullseye with Jesse Thorn is a production of MaximumFun.org and is distributed by NPR.

I'm Jesse Thorn, it's Bullseye.

Josh Goddellman is a stand-up comic and writer. And he's also really nice. Like if you say

his name to somebody in comedy, if you go up to somebody and say, hey, what do you think

of Josh Gondelman? They're going to say, oh, Josh Gondelman, he's so nice. Josh takes

the stage, he says, that he's like, if a cardigan were a person. But Josh Gondelman isn't just nice.

He's also incisive. He's a brilliant writer. He's won two P-bodies and three Emmys for writing

on John Oliver's show last week tonight. These days, he writes for Showtime's Deezison

Mara. He also has a new book out. It's about learning to be nice and how to not let the

nice be the enemy of the good. It's called Nice Try, Stories of Best Intentions and Mixed

Results. Before we get into the interview, let's play a bit of his stand-up. This is from

his most recent album Dancing on a Weeknight, which came out earlier this year.

The confidence comes out in weird ways. We took her out to lunch. At the end of the

meal, the waiter comes over. He says, would you like some dessert? We have one dessert

special today. It's a slice of pumpkin pie. My great aunt looks in the eyes and goes,

we'll have some grapes for the table. He goes grapes. She goes for the table. The waiter walks

out of the room, presumably, to quit is what I thought was happening. I'm going back

to law school like my dad keeps saying. Comes back two minutes later, three bowls of

grapes for the table. There weren't even grapes on the menu at this restaurant.

Josh Connellman, welcome to Bullseye. It's nice to have you on the show. Thank you so much

for having me. I see it's a pleasure to be here. Josh, are you a nice man? I try. What does

that mean? I try to be courteous and helpful and pleasant and not a monster. Is that something

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