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This is the Tom Hartman program.

Well, the line with us is our buddy, Dr. Michael Mann, the University Distinguished Professor and

Director of the Center for Science, Sustainability and the Media at the University of Pennsylvania,

the author of a number of books, most recently, The New Climate Wars, Michael Mann with two ends,

m-a-n-n.net is his website, has Twitter handle is Michael E-man, m-a-n-n.

Dr. Mann, welcome back to the program.

We haven't talked since the COP27 event.

Curious your take on what happened there.

Yeah, thanks Tom, it's good to be with you.

And, you know, COP27 was in some ways successful, in other ways not so successful,

relative, for example, to the previous International Climate Summit in Glasgow a year ago.

We did see the approval of a loss in damage clause, basically, in the international climate

agreement. And what that will do is essentially, you know, come up with funds from the industrial

powers of the world, those countries like the US, the EU, who have benefited from two centuries

of cheap access to dirty energy at the expense, of course, of the rest of the world.

...