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From KQED.

This is Forum. I'm Rachel Myro and Fermin for Mina Kim. In the beginning was the Internet, and it was good at first,

especially for collaborative research and building communities. Then in Genesis 2, the Internet became the world's biggest shopping mall. But still, the people rejoiced.

Let's sew when the ad surveillance

economy kicked in, but by then we were all locked in. Now, many of us feel trapped,

using platforms that capitalize on our attention and distract us from the feeling we're living

in someone else's dream of world domination, which is why I'm so

thrilled today to have Tim Wu in studio with me, because if anyone can talk about the

concentration of economic and political power by big tech, it would be you, Tim. Thank you so much

for being here. Oh, my God, it's such a pleasure to be here. I was saying earlier, I used to listen to

a forum every day when I lived in Silicon Valley, so it's just so great to be back. So I thought we might start with another question that refers in this case to a TV show. What happened to the dream of the 1990s? That is the question that my book basically is trying to answer.

You know, when you think about the 1990s, the dream of the Internet is that it was going to make

everybody rich and that it was going to spread democracy the whole world, just kind of a creative

outlet for anyone and so forth.

And, you know, a big...

It didn't happen all at once, as you said in the introduction.

There's a lot of turning points, I think.

...