Hi, I'm Patrick Adams.

And I'm Sarah Rafferty.

And this is Sidebar, a suits watch podcast where we watch episodes of the show and discuss.

And this week is part two of our conversation with suits creator Aaron Korsh and producing director Kevin Bray.

If you haven't listened to part 1 yet, pause and go back.

It was such a fun conversation, hearing stories from creating the show,

what really worked for them in the first season, and how they see the characters.

And in this episode, we go even deeper with their theories on the can opener.

We hear some great casting stories and more behind the scenes details.

So please enjoy our conversation with Aaron and Kevin.

Thank you. When I'm watching the show, I'm viewing it from my experience in the world as a woman.

And what was interesting about Donna, until Malik came in and really kind of tried to tear her down status-wise and make people assume that she was where she was because she slept with Harvey.

Until then, we didn't really have Donna have any issues around status.

And I think, and as I'm watching season one and remembering these moments, like, even

there's kind of a one, or it was in Felix's episode where she says, you're such a wuss.

Like, even the fact that she said that to him, I remember being with you and being like, wait,

really? Like, she really talks to him like this? We had a scene in the finale that we cut when she walks in and she says like, what the hell is wrong with you?

We ended up cutting it because it was a little too soon to show that side of their relationship.

You were saying we were going to save it for season two.

But she walks in and she's talking about Cameron Dennis, I think.

And she's like, you know, she's just telling him like it is. And I remember

needing little nudges to not have there be any status issue between Harvey and Donna. And you,

...