Christopher Rufo: On Civil Liberties, the American Founding, Academic Freedom, and More
System Update with Glenn Greenwald
Rumble
4.7 • 1K Ratings
🗓️ 8 May 2025
⏱️ 78 minutes
🧾️ Download transcript
Summary
Christopher Rufo and Glenn Greenwald debate the role of government in higher education, the meaning of academic freedom, the American Founders' vision for universities, and more.
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| 0:00.0 | Good evening. It's Wednesday, May 7th. Welcome to a new episode of System Update, our live nightly show that airs every single Monday through Friday at 7 p.m. Eastern exclusively here on Rumble, the free speech alternative to YouTube. |
| 0:29.0 | Tonight, regardless of what you think of him, or really about any issue, there's no denying the profound influence that tonight's guest, Christopher Rufo, has had on conservative |
| 0:39.0 | politics and then state and federal policy more broadly. |
| 0:43.3 | Though he has often focused on educational debates and educational institutions, Florida |
| 0:48.3 | Governor Ronda Santas, for example, appointed him to a key position to transform that state's new school from an institution, |
| 0:56.0 | largely producing left-wing thought, to one that is more aligned with conservative educational dogma and policy. |
| 1:03.0 | He was also instrumental in publicizing the plagiarism, the serial plagiarism, of Harvard President Claudine Gay, |
| 1:10.0 | which, along with issues regarding |
| 1:11.5 | campus Israel protests and anti-Semitism led to her firing after only six months in that position. |
| 1:18.8 | And in general, he's become one of the most influential voices that shapes the views of leading |
| 1:24.2 | conservative politicians and media figures. |
| 1:26.4 | Riffel appeared on our program once before back in 2023, where we spent an hour exploring his |
| 1:31.9 | core beliefs and goals, some of which I agree with and some of which I do not. |
| 1:36.5 | The conversation was spirited but unfailingly civil, and I think illuminating of some of the |
| 1:42.1 | controversies surrounding his work. |
| 1:44.8 | What prompted Rufo's appearance tonight were comments that I had made about him and other right-wing figures |
| 1:50.2 | in an interview I gave about the Trump administration to Reason magazine. |
| 1:54.5 | Rufo saw those comments, noted them, and objected to them on X, |
| 1:58.9 | and when I responded, it led to a back and forth, but it became |
| 2:03.0 | rapidly apparent, at least to me, that social media was the absolute worst venue to try to sort |
| 2:08.4 | through those issues we were discussing, some of which have a lot of complexity and nuance to them. |
| 2:14.6 | Things like the core values of the American founding, the values in views that most influenced the founders, and how all of them. Things like the core values of the American founding, the values and views that most |
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