Catherine Austin Fitz, thank you for doing this.

Hucker, thank you for doing this.

The first time we did an interview over a year ago, different worlds completely,

and I remember thinking, wow, I've rarely spoken to anyone who thinks in such big terms,

I mean that as a compliment, I wonder if this is all true. I think time has proven you, right? We've had a couple of meals in the subsequent months, and so I'm just, I just want to say, I think you're really wise, and I'm grateful to have you. So I want you to know it was only 10 months ago, but it seems like a long, long time. Man.

Time is flying.

Yeah, I meet people in airports all the time are like, I used to think I was a conspiracy theorist, but now I know.

But it's kind of a variety of that.

But last time we had lunch a couple months ago, you were telling me about, and I wish we had this on tape, maybe we can recreate it here, about the

control grid, a concept that you had explained when we last in an interview, and how it was,

as you said, at lunch snapping into place. Can you, can you just, for people who haven't seen your

previous talk, explain what the control grid is what looks like and what it means.

So the control grid is a process or an infrastructure that allows digital technology to be used

to assert phenomenal surveillance and control of people. And at the very heart of it is what I call programmable money.

So it's money that is no longer just a currency.

It's money that comes with a set of rules that can be surveilled and forced.

So imagine back in the pandemic, if your money, if I said, okay, you've got a lockdown and your money won't work if you leave your house.

You can't buy gas in your car because your money is programmed with AI and software to enforce a whole set of centralized rules.

And programmable money allows the bankers who've been running monetary policy to now control fiscal policy and essentially

replace legislatures and executive branch by making and enforcing the rules through the money.

Now, that requires a large infrastructure of surveillance.

So you need digital IDs, and then you need the hardware locally and globally to do the surveillance

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