This is The New Yorker Radio Hour, a co-production of WNYC Studios and The New Yorker.

Welcome to The New Yorker Radio Hour. I'm David Remnick. To look around the United States today

is enough to make prophets and angels weep. James Baldwin wrote that in 1978,

and the same thing can be said of the terrible moment in which we live now.

The cruelty, the heedlessness with which George Floyd was killed

is sickening to consider.

With Floyd face down on the street and begging for his life,

a Minneapolis police officer dug his

knee into Floyd's neck for nearly nine minutes. Every second of it captured on video by bystanders.

But perhaps what was most appalling is that it was hardly exceptional. It follows the recent

killings of Ahmed Arbery and Brianna Taylor,

and many other deaths at the hands of law enforcement in a decades-long litany of racist police abuse.

Where do we go from here? Jolani Cobb has been writing about this for the New Yorker for years,

and last week he spoke with both an activist based in Minneapolis

and a former police officer. We'll hear first from Ron Davis, who served as an officer and then a

police chief for almost 30 years, and he was then appointed to the Department of Justice by President

Obama, where he led several initiatives to improve policing. Here's Jelani Cobb with Ron Davis.

Mr. Davis?

Yes, sir.

Thank you for your time.

I guess I would ask you personally,

when did you see this video of Mr. Floyd's death?

...