After President Biden gave his son Hunter an expansive pardon, legal experts have questioned how a president's

pardon power could be used moving forward. That includes questions about the possible use of preemptive

pardons. To discuss, I'm joined now by Kim Whaley. She's a professor at the University of Baltimore

School of Law, and author of the book, Pardon Power,

How the Pardon System Works and Why. Kim Welley, welcome back to the News Hour.

Hello, great to be here. So before we move into some of the questions that folks have now,

I want to start with that pardon by President Biden of his son. It's drawn mixed reviews,

even from members of his own party, as you've seen.

But you have defended his decision to issue that pardon. Tell us why. Well, it doesn't fall in the

category of a self-dealing pardon. A Hunter Biden's not someone that there's a concern that he'll go on

to commit violent crimes or even additional crimes. He paid back his tax liability with interest. The gun

charge was for a very low level offense that even the likes of Lindsey Graham have said publicly

probably would not have been prosecuted if he had not been the president's son. And of course,

for both of those, he had relapsed into his addiction after the death of his

brother, Bo. So it appears to be that the president is anticipating vengeance or retaliatory

investigations or prosecutions of his son under the next Trump administration, which, of course,

Donald Trump has been very public about his plans to use the Justice Department for that reason.

And the Supreme Court, last summer in its immunity decision, held that crimes committed using the Justice Department would be immune from any oversight.

So it seems like Joe Biden's responding to the moment that is this incoming administration that we've never seen in

American history. So it's almost a reaction to that and less sort of a pardon for his own

self-interest. Well, let me ask you about this moment we're in then, because related to some of

these points you're raising, you're right, President Trump has previously said that he wants to use law enforcement to target some of his

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