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Hello, welcome to coffee house shots.

I'm James Heel.

I'm joined today by Tim Shipman, the politicalist of The Spectator, and Yoshi Heroninman, who writes for The Manchester Mill.

Now, Tim, you've written for this week's magazine where you've talked about who the real

Andy Burnham is. How did you get on?

I went back and talked to a lot of the people who knew him when he was younger in Westminster

to try and find out how much of the Burnham kind of that we know, read about and see today

is someone who was formed in Westminster or was formed in kind of

pushing against Westminster. And I think the interesting thing to me was we've got this view of

Burnham as this sort of slightly moaning character who came to London, didn't enjoy himself

very much, thought the establishment, Westminster, the game

was all a terrible thing, and then sort of went off to Manchester to find himself.

I think the interesting thing is that's not quite right.

A lot of the people who were special advisors, cabinet ministers with him at the time,

remember a guy who was still quite focused on his family, where he'd come from in the

north-west, and didn't really kind

of embrace that whole sort of Blairite, bright young thing's world that a lot of them kind of fell

into that generation of people, Ed Balls, James Pernel, the Miliband brothers, they all became this

kind of, you know, bright young intellectual powerhouses. And I think to a degree,

...