It's the Brian Lera Show on WNYC.

Good morning in everyone.

With us now the Dutch sociologist and geographer Hein de Haas,

who has studied immigration for three decades and tries to bust myths that he sees as

coming from both the political left and political right. He is a professor of

sociology at the University of Amsterdam and a founding member of the International Migration

Institute at the University of Oxford.

And he has a new book called How Migration Really Works, the facts about the most divisive issue in politics.

With Republicans through Donald Trump channeling Hitler and calling immigrants vermin and

saying they're poisoning the blood of Americans and with

Democrats like Mayor Adams and President Biden conflicted on how to manage the

recent asylum seeker surge into New York and the US.

And Ahas's own country of the Netherlands,

having just given an election victory

to anti-immigration, anti-Asylem and anti-Islam

populist here at Wilders, let's see what Hindahaz has to say about, as his book title puts it,

how migration really works. This is in 22 chapters and each chapter busts one myth as he sees it.

Professor D'Hoss, welcome to WNYC.

Hello from New York.

Thanks a lot.

Thanks a lot.

You're right, first of all, that the world is not experiencing an unusual surge in migration

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