I'm going to Hi and welcome to the working songwriter. The show where today's best songwriters come to talk shop.

I'm your host, Joe Pug.

Each episode here we host a distinguished guest,

and we ask them to go deep on their inspiration,

on the process, on the general ups and downs

of making a life in music.

So, whether you're a grizzled veteran litigating against open AI

for scraping the contents of your life's work

to make their free song creator, or else a scrappy upstart making your life's work with

open AI this is your show because ultimately it is what every writer seeks most an ironclad excuse to put off actually writing. Hey everybody it's the first Friday of June 2024 and I thank you for joining us.

This week's show is brought to you by Banzougal.

Built by musicians and for musicians, Banzougal is an all in one platform to build a beautiful website for your music.

I'm old enough to remember when you had to pay somebody called a web developer to get a

website made.

It would always be some guy named Lander who drove a Mitsubishi Galant with a catalytic

converter that had been stolen but not replaced. And who was always trying to sell you

CBD gummies that were wildly expensive expensive but which did not make you feel any

different whatsoever. An old Lander would charge you about a thousand bucks for

a website that would be obsolete in six months, But it's the future now, you guys, that's not

how it works anymore. We're allowed to have nice things now. One of those nice things is Banzougal.

For over 20 years, Banzouel has made it easy to build a stunning website and online store

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