I think we lose sight of the beauty, the most beautiful things I look back on in my life.

Are coming out from underneath things I didn't know I could get out from underneath.

You know, the moments I look back in my life and thank God, those are the moments that made

me were moments of struggle.

In a culture where we like to fix or prevent vulnerability, Brunei Brown is reviving the

knowledge that our struggles make us who we are.

And it's based on data, social scientific research she conducted first into shame and

then into qualities that distinguish lives with a strong sense of worthiness.

She's frank about the resistance her own findings awakened in her, a classic American perfectionist

who wore exhaustion as a status symbol.

She also discovered a stark gulf between what we want to be true and what is true in vulnerability

between men and women.

And she exquisitely, uncomfortably describes the difference between making our children happy

or raising brave and engaged human beings.

I'm Christa Tippett and this is on being.

I spoke with Brunei Brown in 2012.

She's a research professor at the University of Houston Graduate School of Social Work

and she's the author of several books including The Gifts of Imperfection and Daring Greatly.

Millions of people have viewed Brunei Brown's talk at a TEDx event in Houston and her later

talk on the main stage at TED with the arguably unappealing title Listening to Shame.

So I've been steeped in you for the last few days and I thought I might start by mentioning

one of the articles about you in the telegraph, the UK, that started out.

...