This program is sponsored by the Covley Foundation based in Los Angeles, California.

The Covley Foundation is dedicated to advancing science for the benefit of humanity.

I'm Alan Olga, and this is Clear and Vivid, conversations about connecting and communicating.

When someone else is sharing a story with you, you have to understand that how they see the world is as true and real as how you see the world.

You know, it's not like, wow, their view of the world is broken. No, their view of the world is different.

So part of empathy is listen to what that story meant to them.

So like if you tell me a story, I'm like, Alan, I don't know why you're so upset about it. It's not a big deal.

That's not a big deal. People do that all the time. I'm not hearing what it meant to you.

And that becomes an empathic, what we call an clinical work in empathic myths or an empathic failure.

That's Brunei Brown. Her career as a social scientist has given her insights in how to avoid empathic failures.

And her talent as a natural communicator is allowed her to bring those insights to millions.

Her TED talk has been viewed over 48 million times.

Our conversation ranged from what's the best way to ask your mate if they've taken the trash out, to how she's identified and teaches the four skills she says are vital to being more empathic.

This is so great to be talking with you today because we talk all the time on this show about compassion and connection.

And that's your thing. I want to talk about all of it, but I also want to talk about funny because you're funny.

Am I funny? Oh my god, Alan, all to call me funny. This is, this is I'm done like life made. No, I know you're funny.

You hear the laughs rolling in and I can tell that you you're going for them, but in the most natural way, it doesn't sound like you're trying to be funny, which is the essence of being funny.

I think that you don't sound like you're trying to. Yeah.

And I heard you on your podcast unlocking us. I listened to when you were interviewing Judd Apatil.

Does he see Apatil or Apatil? They told me how because it rhymes with cow is what was in my notes.

Oh, well, that's it here because it rhymes with cow.

So you were asking him about what the essence of funny is.

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