Hi, producer Ben Kieberg here. Author Tanny Shannon interviewed Hilton Crawford in prison

over the course of years for his book, See to Villeney, and early on, Tanny Tape recorded his interviews.

My first interview with Crawford was in December of 1996,

and I continued to use recording devices until probably early 1999 when the warden withdrew my privileges with taking in recording devices.

When I heard about Taney's tapes, I lit up.

As a podcast producer, recordings like this are gold.

I'm always trying to get as close to the horse's mouth as I can,

so I was excited by the possibility of using these

tapes in the podcast.

I interviewed Tanny Shannon multiple times and always asked about these recordings.

We talked about the tapes and that stuff. I was curious if you

had any more time to think about that. I've thought about it but I haven't come to a decision that's kind of giving up my

intellectual property and I don't really feel very good about doing that.

Honestly, the last few years that I went and taped the interviews, we were more or less just visiting.

Most of the interviewing was actually done.

Throughout our interviews, Tanny remained hesitant to share the tapes and I struggled to understand exactly why.

You'd mention those audio recordings. I don't know if maybe it's something where, you know, I can be like looking over it, but you know, it stays in your possession if that kind of helps at all from from your

perspective well i'm i

we'll have to talk about that i'm'm not, you know, I don't mind sharing a little, you know,

odds and ends here and there, but just turning you over the tapes. I'm not I don't feel good with that.

But just so I can understand is that like because you're afraid of us misusing it or it's stuff that kind of you feel is between

you and Crawford's you're uncomfortable with just anyone even hearing it.

...