Hi, I'm Rachel, and on today's NewsHit's been podcast, I'm talking to former Conservative MP

and one Sloan character for the Conservative leadership, where we steer it.

Well, Rory, thank you so much for joining us, as much as I know you've been travelling,

you're currently in Boston. There's been a bit of news over the last week in terms of politics

that I wrote absolutely love to get your thoughts on a bit later, but first, most importantly,

in addition to the podcast that you already have, Rest is Politics, you've got a new BBC

Radio 4 series coming out next week called The Long History of Argument, which is all about

how we argue and why and how we can argue better, arguing, what could possibly have been

the inspiration for that? Well, as you're implying, we live an incredibly

argumentative age. I think it's part of living in an age broadly of populism. Something changed

in the world, about 2014-2016, and that was the moment where Trump begins to emerge in America,

where the Brexit referendum happens, where Bolsonaro is elected in Brazil, where the

red remotery takes over in India, where a new populous government comes and opponent

we enter a world of incredibly divisive forms of argument, and argument which at its

worst drives us apart rather than bring us together. And this show is about where that

moment came from, and it's some ideas on what we could do to repair it, because I think

arguing well is absolutely vital to our future. Well, I really just listened to episode

1. It's reviewed by the way in this week's edition of The New Statesman and available online.

I loved it. I love how fun and eclectic it is. You've got Cicero and Aristotle there,

interspersed with Barack Obama and Trump, and the rapper Tupac, I think. It's great fun,

but what you mainly touch on the first episode is this kind of golden age of arguing,

where it was all about understanding and empathising with your opponents, even if you didn't

...