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Hello and welcome to this very special interview episode of Favourite or For Saken. I'm your host, Max McCoy.

And today, I'm going to be talking about a very good friend, Ben Kirby.

Hey! My name's Ben Kirby, and I run an Instagram account called Preachers and Sneakers,

and I wrote a book about it.

Like most everyone, I got to know Ben from the distance through the cultural phenomenon that is his Preachers and Sneakers Instagram account.

I've been fascinated not just by the spotlight he has shown on the issue of the celebrity pastor, as well as the reaction to the spotlight.

Having already recorded an episode about Slepte Christians last December, I thought a conversation with someone who has been immersed in that nuanced and vitriolic topic would be a great extension on what Aaron Jamie and myself talked about previously.

In this episode's conversation, we talked through the formation and development of Ben's Instagram account, the reactions to that account.

And we talked at length about his book, Preachers and Sneakers, Colin Authenticity in an age of four-profit faith and one of these celebrities.

And I just want to say, we don't talk about the book because I'm contractually obligated to talk about an interview subject's book.

I really actually enjoyed it, and I think I green-lit it on the podcast a few months ago.

But I liked it because it asks a lot of worthy questions that are sometimes difficult to discuss and perhaps even more difficult to neatly resolve.

If you haven't read it yet, don't worry. You won't miss anything in this interview, but I do suggest picking up a copy after you listen.

All right, without further ado, here's my conversation with Ben Kirby.

All right, man. Before we start, here's what I want. Here's what I want from you.

Okay, I want, well, you set a baseline for people because obviously we're going to talk about your book.

We're going to talk about your Instagram account.

And I think for our listeners, if they only know you from the gram or if they only know you as like an idea, why don't you like lay a baseline and like talk about who you are, like as a as a faith person, are you a pleaded pants, potluck, gospel hymns kind of guy?

Are you a godless youth with impeccable style and no morals somewhere in the middle, like where you at?

Yeah, I probably, I guess I probably still hold the card for the pleaded pants and potlucks.

I grew up in North Louisiana, which is what else is there to do than go to church.

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