Hi, I'm Susie Larson. Thanks for listening to this podcast for Middays with Susie Larson.

It's only just a matter around. Thanks so much for listening. Thanks so much for listening. Because walking just won't do dance. You don't have to know how to ever since, ever since we've got you late.

Thanks so much for listening to this bonus podcast.

I'm Susie Larson.

This is Middays.

Having a great conversation with Dave Willis on the live show.

So we held him over for some bonus content.

Title of his book, Raising Boys Who Respect Girls, Upending Locker Room Mentality, Blind Spots, and Unintended Sexism.

Dave, this is such an important timely message.

Thanks for giving us some extra time today.

Well, thank you for having me, Susie.

It's a privilege.

Looking forward to this.

So in the book, you identify seven areas where modern men often miss the mark. And I'd like to just walk through each one where you could maybe unpack a little bit more and then cast a vision for a better way.

But here's one. We prioritize career and or hobbies ahead of family. That's a common way that men

miss the mark. So say more. Yeah, absolutely. I think that there's there's something inherent in

most men where we like to do things where we can see measurable results. You know, we want to know if we're absolutely. I think that there's something inherent in most men where we like to do things where we can see measurable results.

You know, we want to know if we're winning. I think it's part of why guys are drawn to sports is because the rules are so clear, and it's so easy to know how many points your team has, what it takes to win.

And sometimes the things that matter most, like marriage and family and home, they don't have nearly as clear as scoreboard.

And so because a guy can't measure his progress, so to speak, at home, I think he's often drawn to looking for counterfeit ways to meet that need to know that he's winning.

And he'll do it through escaping into a career where he can measure it

by dollars or escaping into hobbies where he can, you know, measure it in other ways through

...