In the 1970s, just as New York is cementing itself the center of the fire industries on a global scale, it was crowned the fire capital of the world.

And the two distinctions were linked and they were linked because of insurance.

And the backdrop to that line of inquiry is kind of what first pulled me into the project in terms of the kind of mystery that I was chasing after. It was like, how did the redlining era give way to the Death Panel.

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I'm Beatrice Alder Bolton and today I'm here with my co-host, Tracy Rosenthal.

Hello.

And we're really excited and honored to be joined by our guest, Bench Ansfield, to talk about

their new book.

Bench is a historian of racial capitalism, the carceral state, and 20th century U.S. cities.

They are an assistant professor of history at Temple University, and their book, which we're talking about today, is called Born in Flames, the Business of Arson and the Remaking of the American City, and it was published by W.W. Norton in August of 2025.

Bench, welcome to the death panel.

Thank you so much. It's really good to be here. I'm such an admirer of 2025. Bench, welcome to the death panel. Thank you so much. It's really good to be here.

I'm such an admirer of both of you. I'm really excited to get into it with you. I'm so excited to

have you here today, Bench. I've been eagerly anticipating reading this book for literally years now,

...