Doubt is eliminated through action, but it's the type of action that is important. So you got bored and decided on the FBI or what happened? No, that was so. Yeah, so the transition was 9-11. I was in I was in the city 9-11. I was doing a business deal and we were I was downtown and I'm not making this more dramatic than it is I was about a couple of blocks away from where the rubble ended right so we I was safe but I walked a couple blocks south and then you would have seen it.

So, you know, my brother-in-law worked in the towers, so I called my sister and I said hey where is he and she he had quit his job a couple of days

before he went in to pick up his final paycheck and say goodbye to everybody you

know devastating so I ran to the upper and say goodbye to everybody. Devastating.

So I ran to the upper east side where my sister was.

We did the whole thing, went through the hospitals, handed out the pictures.

It was morbid.

So he lost his life?

Yeah, yeah, yeah, he died.

And so that's when, you know, he said,

this is, I've got to find a way back into this thing.

So I went and got myself medically cleared,

which is a whole another fun story,

maybe for a different day, but, and then I applied

to the usual suspects, the FBI and the CIA and the FBI it was and I got to work

counter terrorism in at a New York City and it was awesome.

Yeah, and that, so that was the turning point because I was happy in the private sector.

You know, I had changed jobs.

I was selling software, the Times software is the big sales thing. So was fine I was happy but you know that was it

so what were the key differences between leading a SWAT team versus leading you you know, a seal platoon.

Well, so, SWAT...

We're in the cultures and the environment, you know, just...

...