The

The Hello and welcome to Behind the News. My name is Doug Henwood.

Consistent with my aspiration to be the

still point of a turning world, the usual two guests and two segments today. Elon Pape will talk,

hopefully in the original sense of the word, about a deepening crisis in Israeli society that could

lead the world to a better place. And Jennifer Berkshire will report in the horrors of the Trump

administration's educational agenda. Elon Pepe is an Israeli historian who has written extensively

on his native country and historic Palestine, which includes the occupied territories as well.

He taught at the University of Haifa from 1984 to 2006, but subject to the relentless hostilities suffered by critics of Israel,

he left for the University of Exeter in the UK. Pepe, a prolific author of both academic histories

and popular works, is just out with Israel on the brink and the eight revolutions that could lead

to decolonization and coexistence, published by Beacon Press. As I said earlier, although the book

deals with some grim material, there's still something deeply hopeful about it, that Israel's many

and deepening problems could lead to a productive crisis. As far from the certainty, of course,

the sort of crisis Pepe is talking about could also lead to more violence, more hate,

more exclusions. And his view of the current ceasefire is hardly a sunny one. But let's listen to

Elon Pepe, describing how things could take a turn for the better over the longer term.

We recorded this interview on Monday, October 13th, so any time references should be adjusted

accordingly. Elon Pepe.

Before we get to your book, we have to talk about current events, the current ceasefire.

It looks like Biden could have done something like what Trump did in late October

2023, the passage of time, of course, the extent of the massacre, have changed the political

...