The

The Hello and welcome to Behind the News. My name is Doug Henwood. A departure from Orthodoxy

today, it's hard to stick to the straight and narrow, you know. Three guests, three segments.

We'll hear from the social psychologist Tessa West on the dynamics that held the Jeffrey Epstein

gang together, from Nick Cernick on AI, and then finally from Wanda Bertram on the cost of mass

incarceration.

There are many unanswered questions about the Jeffrey Epstein affair, starting with some basics,

like where did his money come from, and what was his appeal to the rich and prestigious?

Yes, there was a hard exploitation of young women and girls, but it seems likely that there are other factors at work, too. As for where his money came from,

I think we don't know, and the way things are going we may never know. How did this not particularly

smart or charming guy, at least judging from interviews, gather this posse around him? In his long

conversation with Steve Bannon, his comments on finance, his supposed area of expertise,

weren't particularly impressive.

His emails were barely literate. What was the adhesive? And how much did his circle know about his

dark evil practices? To explore these questions, we're joined by Tessa West, a professor of psychology

at NYU who specializes in interpersonal and group dynamics. Her 2021 book, Jerks at Work, Toxic

Co-Workers and What to Do About Them has a seriously catchy title, though sadly I haven't read it.

Tessa West. I've been mystified just trying to figure out what brought all these people around

Jeffrey Epstein. From the interviews I've seen, he doesn't seem that intelligent or appealing or charming or anything. Obviously, there were sexual appeals, but I don't think that

was the entire story. So I'm really curious to talk to you about the psychology that produces

a group of people like this. It was obviously an in-group, and anyone who's been through high

school has a instinctive feeling for what an in-group

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