This is the on the reasonable doubt with your hosts, Mark Garagas and Gary Smith.

Welcome to Beyond the Reasonable Doubt with obviously my favorite guest and longtime

friend Drew Pinsky.

I wanted to talk to you about Lori Valow and get your kind of impressions, especially

now that you're dipping your toe back into expert work.

She is a mother who they call her the Doomsday Mom because she was attracted to kind of this

junior varsity cult, if you will.

It used to killing her kids.

There's a horrifying tape of her talking to her friend, pretending the kids are alive

and safe when it appears from all the evidence that in fact they were already dead and buried.

She has this case is taking a while to get to trial because she becomes incompetent at

various stages.

She's now on trial.

The jury, when they listen to the tape, I just reference people in the courtroom said

that the jurors were horrified.

You might imagine.

This is my and she does not want, I know it's got kind of a peculiar mental health issue,

but my experience, something to resonate with me is she did not want her lawyers to use

the mental health defense.

Right, she did not.

She was cognizant, at least of them was able to at least presumably engage with the lawyers,

but at some level said, I'm not crazy, I'm not going there, I don't endorse this.

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