This battle for free speech, it keeps getting roped in.

So no matter what the cause is, all right, to DEI, well, we're going to find a way,

the government's going to find a way through National Science Foundation to push a censorship regime.

Well, there is a battle for the heart of free speech, especially during COVID and now, right now,

it's a wide open field.

In Australia really seems to be one of the ground zero's, if not ground zero for

this. And we take it to Australia right now. And there is a talk that was being done on

misinformation, actually. And this is Kim Williams. He's a chairperson of the Australian

broadcasting company. He holds a very senior position. He was asked a question by an audience member,

and this is how it went. Take a listen.

Good. I have a question about Joe Rogan, and you've sort of touched on elements of this in the

US. He's obviously the world's most popular podcast host. He has three billion listeners.

He's sort of managed to successfully capture that bro market in America. And his influence is such that in the wake of the US election,

the Democrats have said that one of Carmel Harris's mistakes

was that she didn't appear on his program.

So I'm just wondering if you had any observations about what's behind the Joe Rogan effect,

how you believe he's managed to so successfully capture this huge market?

And then for us here in Australia, you know, how would or should the ABC be going about

capturing that kind of audience?

Look, I'm not sure that I'm the right person to respond to that question.

I am not a consumer or enthusiast about Mr. Rogan and his work.

Shocking.

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