Hello, Wine Embers. My name is Jesse Meakin with another episode of The Wine Em Podcast,

where we teach you four rules to help you stop if you pay check to paycheck, get out

of debt and save more money. Because I had such a pile of ass Jesse's last week, and

I decided I would do this again. So we've got several more. Amazingly, not amazingly,

not surprisingly. Unsurprisingly, they are all, not all. A lot of them are about credit

cards. I seem to have struck a chord with you listeners and myself. Remember, I'm just

thinking out loud, okay? Catherine says, hi Jesse, I just listened to the credit card

podcast about the banks making money when we swipe, even though we pair CC's off every

month, would we save money if we just use debit cards? I don't want to jump the gun

on an upcoming episode because I need to learn more, feel more and experience more.

But Catherine, my thought is that we do spend more. I spend more. We are a, we're debit

card only in the Meakin household as of a couple of weeks ago. Mark and I were debating

this same topic because it's been on my mind in every podcast. And he and I are both

like, let's do it. Let's just switch. It took me an hour. And my early, early, early

experience is it is different. Our excuse often. And let me be clear, no app, no utility,

no way of doing money handles credit cards better than why not? We, we effectively make

the credit card act like you are budgeting cash because cash, budgeting cash is real.

And that is all is so important when you're actually trying to figure out your priorities.

So we make it like cash. Then we say, well, let me, as long as I'm budgeting, as long

as my money is doing what I want it to do, as long as my money is doing what I desire

it to do. And this is key. Then I'm good. I can use a credit card or a debit card and

it's all the same. And again, thinking out loud. So just let it be. But the idea of our

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