Hello, this podcast is sponsored by the New World magazine. We've been irritating all the right people since we launched in 2016 after the catastrophe of Brexit.

Nigel Farage, Michelle Mone, Boris Johnson, Michael Gove, they all loathe us. Half of them are threatened to sue us, which is why you will love us.

If you've been thinking about subscribing but haven't yet, this is the best offer you'll get this year guaranteed.

For just one pound, you'll get a full month of our journalism, including the magazine delivered to your door each week, daily access to the website and app,

and our 10-year archive of some of the best politics and cultural writing anywhere.

If you like this podcast, you'll love the new world.

And every penny of your subscription pays for the kind of quality, fact-based journalism that the farages of this world cannot stand.

If you don't think that's worth a quid, well, you should give your head a wobble.

So go now to thenewworld.co.com.uk forward slash two mats.

That's the number two, M-A-T-T-S. And claim this exclusive January offer today.

Now, enjoy the rest of the podcast.

Hello, we thought you might enjoy re-listening to an in-depth conversation we had last year on the Two Matters podcast

with the man of the moment, Andy Burnham, Mayor of Greater Manchester, former Cabinet Minister

and of course a man who's had his ambition to run as MP squashed by the Labour NEC

under the direction of Kirstama,

because many believe Burnham is seen as a challenger to the leadership.

So we looked back at the interview we did with Andy last year,

and so much of what he talks about, about power beyond

Westminster, about Labour's current and future trajectory and what politics is like outside of the

bubble have not only not gone away, they have become even more painfully relevant. So if you

miss this first time, it's well worth a listen.

Andy Burnham, speaking to the Two Mats back in February 2025.

...