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The Rest Is Science

Alan Turing’s Final Theory Was About Leopards

The Rest Is Science

Goalhanger

Science, Physics, Mathematics

4.51K Ratings

🗓️ 27 April 2026

⏱️ 58 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

How does a perfectly symmetrical ball of cells become an animal, with a head, a tail, and complex zebra or leopard like patterns? In this episode, we dive into the mind bending science of how order emerges from chaos, guided by an unexpected genius: Alan Turing. From leopard spots and human embryos to crime hotbeds, Hannah and Michael discover the hidden mathematical rules shaping life itself…and the ethical dilemmas that come with them. ------------------- For more information about Cancer Research UK, their research, breakthroughs and how you can support them, visit ⁠⁠https://cancerresearchuk.org/restisscience⁠⁠ Cancer Research UK is a registered charity in England and Wales (1089464), Scotland (SC041666), the Isle of Man (1103) and Jersey (247). A company limited by guarantee. Registered company in England and Wales (4325234) and the Isle of Man (5713F). Registered address: 2 Redman Place, London, E20 1JQ. ------------------- Find The Rest Is Science all over the internet by ⁠⁠clicking here.⁠⁠ ------------------- Video Producer: Adam Thornton + Oli Oakley + Jack Meek Animator: Sam Benson Video & Social: Bex Tyrrell Assistant Producer: Lucy Lipscombe Producer: Simona Rata Senior Producer: Lauren Armstrong-Carter Head Of Digital: Samuel Oakley Exec Producer: Neil Fearn Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Transcript

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0:00.0

Hello and welcome to the rest is science. I'm Michael Stevens.

0:03.3

And I'm Hannah Frye. And I've got a question for you, Michael.

0:05.8

Okay.

0:06.7

It's a bit of a, it's a bit of a weird one, right?

0:09.6

Good.

0:10.2

It's sort of a philosophical question in a way, but maybe also deeply scientific.

0:15.6

If you start out with an embryo and it's just this perfectly symmetrical sphere of cells, how does it ever

0:23.7

decide where the head goes, right? Why doesn't it just, how does it ever end up with any structure?

0:30.0

I mean, when there's already a little bit of structure there, like I get it. Maybe there's

0:34.4

hormones that come from the head cells that let the neck start forming.

0:39.9

But when you're a blastocyst, like just a ball, a symmetric ball of cells, how does it decide,

0:46.7

all right, guys, final positions, you're the butt, you guys are the toes, you're going to be the brain, get to work.

0:53.9

Ready, steady, go.

0:54.9

Which way's up and down? Does it have to do with like local gravity or the parent's body? I don't know. How does it seed those? How does it seed those exactly? But then also, I mean, I mean, you said if there's a little bit of structure there, maybe it makes sense. but at the same time, when you look at physics, if you take, I don't know, like a glass of water, for instance,

1:15.4

and you put a little drop of ink in it, the process that happens there is diffusion. And diffusion

1:20.4

is like the destroyer of patterns. You don't get structure from physical processes. So what is it about biology that means that you end up

1:30.0

with structure? It's a bit of a puzzle. It's a bit of a puzzle. Well, yeah. It's really blowing my

1:35.4

mind because I've seen a blastocyst, a human one through a microscope when it's like eight cells.

1:42.1

And you're like, wow, cool. But how in the world does it

1:46.7

start assigning roles to each cell? And how do you make sure that the two cells on opposite

1:51.9

ends don't both decide that they're going to start forming the brain tube? Right. Am I going to find out

1:58.3

today? I think you are. I think you are. There's going to be an

...

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