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slash change. Hello, this is the Red Box podcast. I'm actually coming up on today's episode.

Does prison work? It's a sort of question that conservatives normally wrestle with,

but it's slightly falling out the headlines with, you know, everything else going on.

So we caught up with Robert Buckland, who was justice secretary in the cabinet up until the

reshuffle in September. We're also going to hear from a former inmate about life on the inside

and life on the outside. So that's coming up in just a moment. But first, it's our columnist

palliates Thursday. So it must be nice at the Marriott. It's India night and James Marriott.

Let's start then with the biggest story of the day and Mike was trying to reach the UK

more than 27 have died in the channel. There's a very simple question to which there is no simple

answer, but what is the solution? India? I thought your opening thing was magnificent, actually,

and the person who didn't like it probably would like what I have to say, which is that

of course it's right to go after people's smugglers and of course there's the lowest of the

load. Franchion tear and minister, I think it was said yesterday that the boat that these poor

...