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It took me about 15 years till I had a palpable career, like something that I could, when I could finally say like, oh, this is actually happening and it's kind of amassed into something I can actually call a career up

until that point. I thought I was doing fine. But then when it actually started to coalesce,

I realized I was like walking on dental floss over the Grand Canyon. I just didn't realize it.

But along that journey up in those 15 years, there were times where I wondered

if I needed to reassess and come up with something else. I just didn't have anything else

that I knew how to do. So if I did, I probably would have done it. Because there were some valleys where I was like,

no one is going to hire me to do any of this.

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