#997 - Bonnie Blue & Louise Perry - The Modern Sex Work Debate

Modern Wisdom

Chris Williamson

Society & Culture, Health & Fitness

4.7 • 4.6K Ratings

🗓️ 22 September 2025

⏱️ 134 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

Louise Perry is a writer, Press Officer for the campaign group We Can’t Consent To This and an author. Bonnie Blue is a British pornographic actress and online content creator. Louise is the author of The Case Against The Sexual Revolution and Bonnie is the world’s most extreme example of the sexual revolution in action, so I figured it might make for an interesting discussion. I wasn’t disappointed. It’s a calm, regulated, deep dive into modern sex culture and feminism. Expect to learn whether Louise thinks Bonnie’s work should be illegal, whether British women are being given a bad name to potential immigrants, whether Bonnie’s fertility problems contributed to her trajectory in life, whether the sexual revolution made women freer or more vulnerable, if Louise thinks that Bonnie is a psychopath, the difference between sex work and performance art and much more… Sponsors: See me on tour in America: ⁠https://chriswilliamson.live⁠ See discounts for all the products I use and recommend: https://chriswillx.com/deals Get $100 off the best bloodwork analysis in America at https://functionhealth.com/modernwisdom Get a 20% discount on Nomatic’s amazing luggage at https://nomatic.com/modernwisdom Get 35% off your first subscription on the best supplements from Momentous at https://livemomentous.com/modernwisdom Get a Free Sample Pack of LMNT’s most popular flavours with your first purchase at https://drinklmnt.com/modernwisdom Timestamps: (0:00) Why Does Bonnie Do Sex Work? (10:50) Bonnie’s Thoughts on What It’s Really Like Sleeping With Lots of Men (16:34) What Motivates Bonnie? (21:37) Why Bonnie Doesn't Mind Women Hating Her (27:42) Louise’s Opinion on Bonnie’s Work (38:53) Is Bonnie’s Fame Culturally Damaging? (52:06) Is Bonnie Teaching Men Safe and Consensual Sex? (01:00:40) Should We Watch More Porn? (01:07:46) What Has Bonnie Lost Through Sex Work? (01:14:49) Bonnie’s Approach to Criticism (01:25:06) How Does Bonnie’s Work Affect Her Family Life? (01:33:14) Why is Bonnie Sensitive About Pregnancy? (01:43:39) What Makes Bonnie So Interesting? (01:52:52) Why Do People Think Bonnie is a Victim? (01:58:36) Louise’s Analysis of Bonnie (02:02:55) Louise and Bonnie’s Steelman Arguments (02:11:19) What Happens Next? Extra Stuff: Get my free reading list of 100 books to read before you die: https://chriswillx.com/books Try my productivity energy drink Neutonic: https://neutonic.com/modernwisdom Episodes You Might Enjoy: #577 - David Goggins - This Is How To Master Your Life: https://tinyurl.com/43hv6y59 #712 - Dr Jordan Peterson - How To Destroy Your Negative Beliefs: https://tinyurl.com/2rtz7avf #700 - Dr Andrew Huberman - The Secret Tools To Hack Your Brain: https://tinyurl.com/3ccn5vkp - Get In Touch: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/chriswillx Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/chriswillx YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/modernwisdompodcast Email: https://chriswillx.com/contact - Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Transcript

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0:00.0	Louise, why were you interested in sitting down with Bonnie?
0:05.3	I find you really interesting. I think that a lot of it, just having talked to women
0:10.6	about doing this conversation, the response from so many women is, I think, something
0:18.8	like more but curiosity. Yeah. Like interested in you, confused by you.
0:22.9	Yeah. And wondering, I mean, the main thing that I'm hoping that to learn about you today,
0:26.6	because I've learned about your work, is your psychology, your personality, what it is about you
0:32.8	that's led you to do this. Yeah. Because I get the impression from having watched interviews with
0:36.9	you and so on that actually,
0:39.3	over the years, I've interviewed loads and those of women or spoken to loads of
0:42.2	women who've been in the sex industry in various ways, whether that's born or prostitution
0:47.0	or brothels, street walking, whatever.
0:48.6	And every single case, they've talked about distress, trauma or having a horrible time, like, to varying degrees.
0:56.6	Yeah.
0:57.3	You don't talk about that. And I think that you're telling the truth. I think actually you don't
1:02.8	find this work causes you psychological harm. Yeah. And I guess I want to find out why. I think that's really interesting question. Yeah. No, I think it's good because everyone always assumes, and even when I say multiple times, I'm not traumatized, I've not had a bad upbringing, everyone thinks I'm lying. And it's really not the case. And it's terrible for some people, unfortunately, about a bad upbringing or terrible things have happened. But for me, I've just chosen to do this.
1:28.8	How familiar are you with Louise's work? Do you know what she writes about? Are you familiar with any of the background?
1:33.5	No, I'm not. Okay. How would you, what's the 30,000 foot view to explain to Bonnie's sort of your philosophical underpinnings?
1:41.5	So I guess I'm coming at this as a conservative. Yeah. And I've,
1:45.6	I mean, I wrote a book called The Case Against the Sexual Revolution. I'm generally critical
1:49.1	of the sexual revolution and porn. I worked in a rape crisis center before I became a journalist,
1:54.5	which I guess is informed my... All sounds very intelligent. Bless you. And I, my general view on
2:00.7	the sex industry is like very negative. So we're, we're going to come out this from different perspectives. But I do like, I'm guessing that a lot of people listening are going to assume that I'm going to try and like uncover trauma in you or I'm going to try and like break through the. You'd waste your time. And I think I actually think that's right. And that's part of the reason I'm interested in, I'm more interested in talking to you than I would be to say Lily Phillips. Yeah. Because I think that Lily, to me and to a lot of people, I think it's clear that Lily is actually suffering quite a lot and is having a hard time. She seems traumatised. Right.
	...

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