99 — Detransitioned & Damaged by the Dutch Protocol: Teiresias
Gender: A Wider Lens
Sasha Ayad and Stella O'Malley
4.6 • 961 Ratings
🗓️ 9 December 2022
⏱️ 145 minutes
🧾️ Download transcript
Summary
In this last episode before our break, we begin with some important and exciting announcements about what listeners can expect in 2023 from Gender: A Wider Lens. We then launch into one of our most important interviews yet: “Teiresias” was a patient at the notorious Dutch clinic. Unlike the common misconception that the Dutch used an air-tight method for correctly identifying kids who would benefit long-term from transition, Teiresias’s detransition reveals the truth about childhood gender medicine, even when it’s being practiced by the “gold standard.”
He speaks out about his medical transition and subsequent detransition. Teiresias was a feminine boy who, with puberty, became increasingly distressed by his same-sex attraction. One day Teiresias watched a TV program where a trans man described the happiness that came about as a result of medical transition. A seed was sown, and Teiresias turned to the internet where he was encouraged by older trans women to transition as soon as possible.
Teiresias describes the way the Dutch clinic ignored his childhood trauma, the difficulties with his father, his self-loathing, and his internalized homophobia and instead, led him on to a medicalized pathway with the gender affirmative approach. An over-eager surgeon encouraged Teiresias to undergo many procedures until one day he realized he was chasing a false dream. He then decided to get off the fast track and began his detransition.
Links:
- Sasha’s Parent Coaching Membership Site:
https://www.subscribestar.com/sashalpc
- Stella’s Substack:
https://stellaomalley.substack.com/
Extended Notes
- Stella shares her experience of speaking with detransitioners from the Dutch clinic.
- Teiresias felt that he had a double side, telling friends he wanted to be a girl.
- His parents switched schools because of the bullying in the previous one.
- At ten, Teiresias felt neutral about being attracted to other boys and said he was gay.
- He thought puberty would make him attracted to women.
- He found himself mimicking straight boys and talking about liking girls while still being attracted to boys.
- At 12 or 13, he used derogatory terms to describe trans people just like everyone else.
- The family went through a difficult divorce while he was entering puberty. It caused him to isolate himself.
- In 2015, a talk show introduced him to a teenage trans man who described how happy he was after transitioning.
- Based on information he found on the internet, he self-diagnosed as bipolar and autistic until finding a trans description he aligned with.
- Teiresias started fixating on certain parts of his body but it never solved a problem.
- After entering the Dutch clinic, he had a specific picture in his mind of the woman he wanted to become.
- During his intake to the clinic in 2015, his mother insisted he was still troubled by his relationship with his father. There was a real-life phase at the clinic where Teiresias was...
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Transcript
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| 0:00.0 | You're listening to gender, a wider lens. |
| 0:04.0 | I'm Stella O'Malley, a psychotherapist in Ireland. |
| 0:06.5 | And I'm Sasha Ayad, an adolescent therapist in the United States. |
| 0:10.6 | Since 2016, my practice has been exclusively dedicated to gender questioning teens |
| 0:16.1 | and families impacted by gender dysphoria. |
| 0:19.0 | I also work with gender questioning teenagers and I facilitated support meetings for families and |
| 0:24.2 | individuals who have been impacted by gender issues. We're curious about the |
| 0:28.0 | concept of gender and how it's unfolding in the wider culture. Join us as we look at gender through a wider lens. |
| 0:35.0 | So as you can tell from the title of this episode, |
| 0:41.0 | this is a really serious and really important conversation that we had with someone who was seen by the Dutch and it's it's a long conversation as well which will explain a little bit more about that later. |
| 0:55.8 | But before we get into the interview, we just wanted to take a moment and share some really |
| 1:00.1 | exciting news with all of our listeners. So Stella and I were together for about a week at the retreat. |
| 1:08.4 | Yeah and I have to say you know we've just come back from the retreat and the benefits of meeting in person |
| 1:16.1 | was so evident even between you and I, Sasha. So we saw the parents, the idea of the retreat |
| 1:21.2 | was the parents come together and it was very powerful very moving some terribly harrowing stories |
| 1:26.4 | and yet some real beautiful |
| 1:29.7 | Communications and kind of warmth and we felt depth of relationships were taking place before our |
| 1:36.0 | eyes friendships were happening and created and it was kind of beautiful and then for |
| 1:41.2 | us you and me we got a chance to strategize. We got a chance for what seems like the first time ever. We're two years into the podcast now. We never knew where it would go. We're thrilled. I think I love it. It's a very, it's a very important part of my week. |
| 2:00.0 | And I think from having met each other, kind of thought right we can we can do things with this we can go new directions we can we there's a lot of of ideas floating around as a result of meeting in person. So it's great to take a break and it's |
| 2:16.8 | great to meet in person because ideas flow from that and I'm really looking forward to this break and I also am really looking forward to our |
| 2:24.1 | our new gender wider lens when we come back in. |
... |
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