Welcome to Public Health On Call, a podcast from the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health,

where we bring evidence, experience, and perspective to make sense of today's leading health challenges.

If you have questions or ideas for us, please send an email to public health question at jhhhu.edu.

That's public health question at jhhu.edu for future podcast episodes.

This is Lindsay Smith Rogers.

Today, what a good judge and a good scientist have in common.

Judge David Tatel served on the U.S. Court of Appeals for the D.C. Circuit for more than 25 years, ruling in many cases involving U.S. public health agencies. He's also the author of a book entitled Vision, A Memoir of Blindness and Justice. He joins Dr. Josh Sharfstein to talk about his career,

the new doctrines of the U.S. Supreme Court, and his gradual loss of sight. They also talk about Vixen, the guide dog that changed his life. Let's listen. Judge David Tatele, it is fantastic

to have you back on the Public Health On Call podcast.

How are you today?

I'm fine.

And thank you for inviting me back, Josh.

Well, I really loved your book, which is called Vision, a memoir of blindness and justice about your career and your life.

And I'm looking forward to talking to you about it.

Yes, as am I.

So let's take these topics a little bit in reverse order.

We'll talk about justice and then we'll talk about blindness.

And I want to start by asking about your career.

Loyal listeners of the podcast know that you served as a judge for many years on the U.S. Court of Appeals for the D.C. Circuit.

But I learned in this book that you started out thinking about science.

My father was a physicist, and he involved me, even as a small boy, in my early teenage years, he

involved me in his work. I spent lots of time with him at his lab and living with

...