I'd like to welcome you to the Symbolic World podcast. On this episode, I'll be playing for you the

second conversation that I had with Paul Vanderclay. Paul Vanderclay is a pastor in California,

who also runs Jordan Peterson discussion groups in which he has monthly meetings with atheists

and agnostics and different people who are searching. So we always have a great time discussing. In this particular discussion, we look at what is quickly getting to be known as the meaning crisis,

how we see the discussion going further in terms of all these people discussing Paul with Paul, John Verveiki, people from Rebel Wisdom,

all these discussions that are swirling around.

And so I hope you enjoy it.

I have a great time talking to him every discussion that I have,

and I'm sure it will have many more.

Music This is Jonathan Peugeot. Welcome to the symbolic world. I feel like it's weird because it happened on on Easter Saturday for Orthodox Easter Saturday and I really feel like I didn't get POSCA like there's no Easter this year

that's kind of how it feels and I'm still kind of in the cave, you know.

I'm still down.

We're still kind of down in that cave.

And so that's kind of how it feels.

But, yeah, at the same time, it's been amazing, you know, it's been amazing.

It's been amazing to see all these people that have supported us financially.

So many messages, prayers, people, you know, it's just been, that's been just astounding for me.

Very touching and encouraging just wants you to not crumble and just keep going.

And so, and I'm not a very practical person, which is one of my, you know, like,

really? Because I'm a carver, they think that I'm a very, that I'm a practical guy, but, but, but, but no,

I, like, I, I can carve the most precise little miniature,

but if I cut the board for my carving,

...