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Freakonomics Radio

662. If You’re Not Cheating, You’re Not Trying

Freakonomics Radio

Freakonomics Radio + Stitcher

Documentary, Society & Culture

4.532.8K Ratings

🗓️ 6 February 2026

⏱️ 53 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

In sports, the rules are meant to be sacrosanct. But when it comes to performance-enhancing drugs, the slope is super-slippery. (Part one of a two-part series.)

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0

There are a lot of explanations going around for why our political moment feels more chaotic than many of us have ever experienced.

0:11.8

Let me offer up one more explanation. It has to do with rules. My belief is that many people,

0:18.0

in many different circumstances, have come to think that the rules we live by are stupid,

0:23.4

so stupid that the only sensible thing to do is break them. And if you get away with it, then you've got the confidence to just keep going.

0:31.4

And now you've got different people playing the game of life by totally different rules. How do we think that's going to work out?

0:39.2

All this got me thinking about one place where rules are still followed, for the most part, at least.

0:45.0

And that's what we're going to talk about today.

0:49.0

Can I take you on a really weird digression?

0:52.0

I would love a weird digression.

0:53.4

Okay, down a rabbit hole?

0:54.5

Sure.

0:54.9

Have you read Alice's Adventures in Wonderland?

0:57.4

Not in approximately 45 years, but yeah.

1:01.1

I read it when I was a sophomore in college.

1:03.5

I was one of those annoyingly good students who took notes in the margins, and I wrote all my papers on time.

1:09.7

Anyway, so my daughter was five or six. I picked up the book again,

1:12.5

and I started reading it to her. This is Louisa Thomas. She writes the sporting scene column

1:18.5

for the New Yorker magazine, and she happens to be married to a former NFL player. Okay, back to

1:23.9

Alice in Wonderland. I picked up the same copy I had had in college.

1:28.1

It was filled with these meticulous notes.

1:31.0

All the words were defined.

1:32.3

The logic puzzles were solved.

...

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