Brett McKay here and welcome to another edition of the Art of Manliness Podcast.

If you struggle with getting your financial house in order, you may feel that what you

need is more information on how things like stocks or IRAs or budgets work.

However, my guest day would say that what you actually need most of all is a better understanding

of the relation that your parents and even your grandparents had with money and how the

money scripts they've passed down to you have affected your own thinking about finances.

His name is Brad Klons. He's a psychologist who specializes in money issues and is the author of

the book Mind Over Money, overcoming the money disorders that threaten our financial health.

We'll be in our conversation discussing what Brad calls the big lie in personal finance.

Brad then explains how money scripts from your childhood can keep you from making progress

with your finances and adulthood. We dig into why you can feel shame over being both poor and rich

while it's hard to move ahead from the socioeconomic status you came from and these do get dragged

back into a financial comfort zone and how you can break out of old and grayed patterns.

We enter conversation with how to be more intentional about the money scripts you're passing

down to your own kids including why you shouldn't tell them we can't afford that. After

shows over check out our show notes at aowm.is slash money scripts. Brad joins me now via clearcast.io.

All right Brad Klons welcome to the show. Excited to be here Brad thanks so much for having me.

So you're a psychologist but you specialize in issues people have with money.

What led you down to go that path with your with your practice or your studies?

Yeah I mean a bit of an adduc for sure thanks for pointing that out. I'll tell you I got out

of graduate school and for those of you who've gone to college you can totally relate to this

and police many of you can. I owed a hundred thousand dollars in student loan debt by the time I was

...