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Brett McKay here and welcome to another edition of the Art of Manliness Podcasts,

like FDR or JFK Ronald Reagan, have become more of a symbol for many Americans than a flesh and blood person.

For some, he's the embodiment of all that's good in America, while for others, he's the very opposite.

But beyond the political divides, who was Reagan the man?

My guest today spent five years researching and writing an epic nonpartisan biography that seeks to bring the abstraction of Reagan back down to Earth.

His name is Bob Spitz and his biography is Reagan in American Journey.

We begin our conversation discussing how Reagan's hard-scrabble childhood in the Midwest and his family staunch progressive politics influenced his early political outlook.

Bob then shares how a young Ronald Reagan showed signs of becoming the great communicator.

As a young man, he was charming in a talent for speaking led to a successful career in radio and the movies.

We then discuss why Reagan went from being a true believing democratic new dealer to being a leader in the burgeoning conservative movement in the 1960s,

Bob then delves into Reagan's leadership styles, government of California and present-unite states,

and the important role Nancy Reagan played throughout his political career.

The inter-conversation discussing Reagan's ultimate legacy.

After the show's over, check out the show notes at a-o-m.-i-s-slash-Ronald Reagan.

Bob Spitz, welcome to the show.

My pleasure. Great to be here.

So you've got an interesting career. You've been in the music industry. You've represented the Partridge family, Bruce Springsteen, Elton John.

Then you've partly led that to a writing career where you've written biographies about the Beatles, history of Woodstock.

But now you've got this tome of a biography about President Ronald Reagan.

So how did you go from writing about pop culture music to President Reagan?

Well, it wasn't just music. In between the Beatles and Reagan, I was Julia Childs biographer.

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