kind of monster, but what's so difficult, I think, for people in our circles to understand is that

he's not wired for ideology. This is a, Trump is a very unique animal. He is a zero-sum guy. He views

the world in terms of, I win, you lose. And this has always been consistent with his economic populism. His tariff policy, you know, he talked about this in 2015. He talked about this in 2020. He talked about it in 24. He's always been a trade protectionist. And Scott, you and I are old enough to remember when Democrats used to like tariffs, when Democrats used to like union protectionism and trade protectionism so that places like Pittsburgh and Cleveland, Ohio would not just dry up and blow away in the wind in the face of international competition. So it, you know, things, it's literally interesting to me that there's so much hue and cry now about his tariffs.

And that's exactly what he talked about. And he believes in that. He believes that we need manufacturing in the United States, not just a service or financial economy. He believes that truly.

And unlike, let's say, some of those neo-liberal opponents who could have become president,

Hillary Clinton, Kamala Harris, Joe Biden, they don't have these strong feelings. In other words,

they are largely, you know, under the tentacles of the investor class, the financial class.

And so we have this switch,

this switcheroo, where economic populism really resides on the right and economic globalism.

And I guess what we call reasonably free market sentiment is now starting to find voice on the left.

And, you know, this is just something that we have to

understand when it comes to Trump. And I think that a lot of us spent many, many years,

many decades, in fact, in these ideological cul-de-sacs. We spent an awful lot of time,

God knows, debating, writing books, books you know coming up with this whole

you know the classical liberalism which I really consider 19th century

liberalism not 20th century and then out of that a a burgeoning libertarian

movement we could say that's mid-century, well,

a little earlier than that, a mid-century with figures

like Rand and Rothbard and then evolving into this broader

ANCAP philosophy, which a lot of us were enamored of for many, many years.

And so we spent all this time in the world of theory. And Trump just comes

along and basically wipes that out. I mean, you know, what he's done in 10 years in terms of a

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