Yeah, well the thing with surfing is you're only going to get worse at it. So you better, I mean you are, you're going to get older. You're going to get, it's going to find it harder. So like you've got to figure out a way to keep evolving as a human to navigate that. I mean, I'm more talking about performance. You're only going to get, like, it's performance surfing, you surfing. You know, this level, I guess the WSL's performance surfing. And if you got to any level close to that, you're only going to get worse. Like I look at, like I look at Skip. I saw a photograph to Skip the other day, right? 78, 79. I think he had a birthday, not sure what age you turned. But I saw this photo of him and he had an 11-foot

surfboard under his arm and he was going out to ride big waves. And I just went, there you go.

Look at that. There's a 78-year-old man completely evolved. He's got the right equipment. He knows

how to still get out.

He's going to be able to paddle into all the waves he wants.

And he's going to ride a wave and probably catch the best wave of his life today.

That's an inspiring thought.

I was inspiring for me to see the photo because I was just,

I was so stoked, you know?

Because last time I surfed with Skippy, he was bummed on something and he didn't he he didn't want to go surfing

because he just there was something going on he didn't want to surf and I was only there for a

couple of days but um he came out and he went past me on this wave and he just he went on his

knees you know and he just I was at water level with him and he went past me on his knees and he had his hands out like a pelican and it was the most unbelievable thing to see and um after the surf he came in and he was all he was happy you know he was back you know, so then to see him the other day,

but I was worried about him. I was thinking, I hope he's not losing that love for it, you know, but then to see that photo in the other day, he just, he hasn't, you know, he's still, he's still trying, he's still making, and this board he had was a bigger board, you know, because he used to write fishes. he's to little fishes and I remember that's why he made the long fish because he said, I just can't ride little fishes anymore, I just can't paddle them, like and I can't get waves on them. And that's the way he made a long fish. So then he was able to access to surf, you know, in his 60s on the long fish. And then he's just making bigger and bigger boards so he can keep staying out there.

So yeah, you should get better at surfing. 60s on the longfish and then he's just making bigger and bigger boards so he can keep

staying out there you know so yeah you should get better at surfing but you're definitely

going to get worse the performance elements of it which are but you should be able to get better

in other ways. Filmmaker, writer, musician, surfboard shaper, Andrew Kidman is our guest today.

All of these titles, those categories, if they are one's professional title, have really radically

been altered in 2020 due to COVID.

So if you're a surfboard shaper, you're experiencing an unprecedented boom in orders.

If you're a musician, on the other hand, you've probably

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