Welcome to the Making Sense podcast.

This is Sam Harris.

Okay, today's episode is a PSA, so no paywall.

As always, if you want to support the podcast, you can subscribe at samherris.org.

Today I'm speaking with Carl Robashow.

Carl co-leads Longview Philanthropies' program on nuclear weapons policy.

And he co-manages their nuclear weapons policy fund.

This is a fund to which the waking up foundation will soon be giving a fair amount of money.

If you'd like to support it along with us, you can find the relevant link in the show notes in your podcast player.

For more than a decade, Carl led grant-making in nuclear security at the Carnegie Corporation of New York.

He also previously worked with the Century Foundation and the Global Security Institute,

where he focused on arms control, international security policy, and non-proliferation.

And the topic of this conversation is the ongoing threat of nuclear war.

We discuss the new film Oppenheimer, which I must say really is a masterpiece.

If you haven't seen it in a theater, and it's still playing in a theater near you, I highly recommend that you see it.

This really is a film that benefits from the big screen.

We discuss the ethics of dropping the atomic bombs on Hiroshima Nagasaki, the Cuban Missile Crisis,

and some of the false lessons we learned there.

The history and the future of nuclear proliferation, the logic of deterrence, our vulnerabilities to cyberattack,

the history of de-escalation, the war in Ukraine, war games, the taboo around using nuclear weapons,

growing tensions between the US and China, artificial intelligence, getting to nuclear zero,

the role of private citizens in mitigating nuclear risk, and finally long-view philanthropies' nuclear risk policy fund,

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