So we see these terms like occupation, ethnic cleansing, colonialism, apartheid and now genocide.

And these are ultimately as false as the ancient blood liable, the allegation that Jews killed

Christian children to use their blood for religious ritual. When you have UN-run schools that

indoctionate kindergarten children to believe that the highest calling in life

is to kill as many Jews as possible. Peace is being pushed further and further away.

Hello, I'm Fraser Myers, Deputy Editor of Spikes, and I'm delighted to be joined in conversation

with Natasha Hausthoff. Welcome. Thank you, Fraser. It's good to be with you. Natasha, you're a barrister,

expert in international law, legal director of UK lawyers for Israel of the Charitable Trust.

You're often on our TV screens defending Israel against what is probably the most serious crime possible. I'm talking

of course about genocide. Some people might say you're defending the indefensible. How would you answer

that? Well, I certainly see myself as defending the proper application of international law and the

rule of law, first and foremost. In this respect, unfortunately, the allegation of genocide being levied against

Israel is an inversion, both of that concept, that international crime, but also of the legal

framework. So the two go hand in hand with the abuse of international law more generally against Israel.

We certainly see it in stark terms in terms of South Africa's allegation of genocide at the

International Court of Justice. And I think the motivations behind South Africa's allegation are extremely political.

But the use of the term genocide in this respect is actually a technical legal hook to bring Israel to the court because the State of Israel is a signatory to the genocide convention on the prevention and punishment of genocide, and thus, you know,

South Africa in terms of bringing this unfounded, untrue allegation is seeking to ground a legal

case against Israel in the context of the jurisdictional framework of the International

Court of Justice. Can you explain in sort of layman's term, what is genocide and why is it a mistake to label

Israel's actions in that way?

Well, the term arose after the Holocaust.

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