Hey there, friends, and welcome to episode 304 of Just the Zoo of Us. This week, I'm joined by

a primatologist and author for a story time of sorts. Our guest shares experiences from her time

working with lemurs in Madagascar and howler monkeys in Belize, like kind gestures from people

helping out their local monkeys after a hurricane.

She also brings us some truly juicy tales from the study of primates, like a true crime

thriller involving missing monkeys, a power struggle, and even a double life, an airplane

full of macaques, setting the record straight on baboon's social hierarchies,

and the instrumental role of women in shaping primatology and our understanding of nature.

Just the Zuvus presents Dr. Carrie Ann McGugan's top three primatology stories. The Hello, everybody. It's Ellen Weatherford with Just the Zoo of Us, your favorite animal review podcast.

I'm so excited because we have a returning friend this week. People who are perhaps longtime listeners may recall quite a few years ago now, I think.

Our guest today joined us to talk about cookgirls Shifaka, also known as Zabumifu for the 90s kids like me.

This is Dr. Carian McGugan. Say hi, Carrie Ann.

Hi, Ellen. Thanks so much for having me. It's a pleasure to be back.

It's so good to hear from you again. Carrie Ann, what are your pronouns?

She, her.

Thank you. You have joined

us today to talk about, you have an upcoming book about really interesting stories and

like profiles of figures from the field of primatology. For people who listening who maybe

don't know very much about primatology, I haven't heard your voice before. How did you get

into primatology, the study of primates? Yeah, so it was kind of a winding path, I would say. I started off

my undergrad as an English major because when I was in high school, I nearly failed my physics class

and decided that I would never again take science. So enrolled as an

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