Hi it's Lauren Smith here, producer of the Brendan O'Neil show.

Before we get into this week's episode with the brilliant Bacheon-Gassagon,

I want to tell you all a bit about our sponsor, the Monk Debates.

If you're listening to this podcast, you're probably interested in hearing leading thinkers

discuss the big ideas of our time so you definitely won't want to miss the next

mug debate on anti-Zionism. On the 17th of June, commentator Douglas Murray

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former MSNBC anchor Medi Hassan and Israeli journalist Gideon Levy.

They'll be discussing where we can draw the line between anti-Zionism and

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check out at monk debates. And now on with the show.

It's really tragic what's happened in America. We still like to see ourselves as a classless society, but meritocracy has calcified into effectively oligarchy of credentialism.

Certain kinds of talents like being able to sit and study for a very long time very much guarantee you a successful life and

other talents that society actually ironically needs much more like being able to sit for 12

hours in a truck we have decided are worthless and the

...