Hi, everybody. We got a great one today, you know, for a change. Today, my guest is Hendrik Hertzberg

from The New Yorker. But that's not why this is a great one. I mean, Rick is an unbelievably well-respected writer for the New Yorker.

It has been for decades. He's won all these awards. He's been winner of the National Magazine Award three times.

But the reason he's here today and why this is a better-than-usual interview is that Rick has been a champion of the

National Popular Vote Interstate Compact.

The National Popular Vote Interstate Compact.

Now, basically, what that is is it's a way to guarantee that the winner of the popular

vote in a presidential election will become the president. In other words, everybody's vote counts.

And I'll explain the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact in a couple minutes.

And then we'll have Rick do a better job of explaining it.

That's what we're doing today.

But first, I want to talk just a little bit about Gordon Sondland, our nation's ambassador to the European Union,

who a couple days ago reversed his testimony about whether President Trump had presented

a quid pro quo to the Ukrainian president.

Now, originally in October, when he testified to investigators, he said that, no, there was

not a precondition placed on our giving the $391 million of military aid to Ukraine.

But a couple days ago, Sondland returned and said that there were, in fact,

conditions placed on that aid.

And the condition was that Ukraine would have to do an investigation into the supposed corrupt

activities by Joe Biden and his son Hunter, obviously so that President Trump could use

that dirt in his reelection campaign against Joe Biden because he assumed Joe Biden would be the nominee.

Of course, he could be the nominee, so it's not a waste of time to do a quid pro quo, even if Biden isn't the nominee.

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