Welcome to Crawl Space, I'm Tim here today with Lance Lance, how are you today?

Tim, I'm doing so well. How are you really? That's what I want to know. I am doing excellent today. Our guest in this episode is fantastic. She's wonderful to talk to and sort of have a deep and detailed conversation with her name is Catherine Jones and she is the co-director of Outreach and partnership development at the campaign for the fair sentencing of youth. Yeah, what an amazing title and perfectly suitable

for an amazing person. She was featured during the death by incarceration live show at the brickbox theater in Worcester, Massachusetts back in November and she just blew it away. Her story is incredible. Catherine was incarcerated at the age of 13. She was just a girl. The age of 13 for murder, you could possibly say she was incarcerated for self-defense and she spent the next 17 years incarcerated. She was released at the age of 30 and she currently uses that traumatic experience to

stand as an advocate for prison reform in her current role at the campaign for the fair sentencing of youth. So check out what Catherine is doing over at the campaign for the fair sentencing of youth. It's CFSY.org. That is the website and we really hope you enjoy this conversation that gets really interesting. Hope you guys feel the same way. And we do feel like this is a very important topic and we were very fortunate to have Catherine on. So feel free to give us some feedback and

just let us know how you feel about what she's speaking of. We'd love to have her back on and we'd love to make this a continuing conversation.

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Catherine Jones, welcome to the podcast. How are you today?

I'm great. Thank you. So excited to be here.

I'm really happy that you took time out of your data. Join us because you have quite a job and we'll get to your job and what you do.

You had joined us for the death by incarceration live show in Worcester, Massachusetts. And before we started the interview, Tim took the words out of my mouth as he typically does and said that you commanded the room.

And it was pretty impressive. You you were joined there by Nikki Bell who we recently had on the show as well and Kevin and Swabe and your story is remarkable. But your engagement with the audience was really noteworthy.

You you made it a point to hug people to you know out of the blue. And you would set after that you don't really prepare your remarks before you speak, which is also impressive.

So I just wanted to compliment you on that and welcome you to the show. And yeah, here she is.

Thank you so much. And I don't want the reasons that I don't typically prepare even for this interview is because I always want my responses to be authentic income from my heart.

It comes with a face of passion because of my experience and passion for the work that I do and for everyone that's coming behind me. So thank you for appreciating that.

Yes, thank you very much. And and the show in Worcester was amazing hearing a bit about your story. It was kind of shocking really all the details about the time you served and what age you started your serving your time.

Would you take us through a little bit of of your story?

Absolutely. And I have the very unfortunate distinction at the age of 13 in 1999 of being in my brother who was 12 of being the youngest children at that time to be sent to adult prison.

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