242. Hard Times with Dave Ramsey: The Bright Side of Adversity
At The Table with Patrick Lencioni
Patrick Lencioni
4.8 • 1.1K Ratings
🗓️ 13 May 2025
⏱️ 36 minutes
🧾️ Download transcript
Summary
How do we as business leaders not be discouraged by hard times and instead see the good that can result from them?
In episode 242 of At The Table, Patrick Lencioni welcomes legendary financial expert and leadership voice Dave Ramsey for an unfiltered conversation about hard times. As Pat mentions in the intro, this is not your average interview. They discuss the current economic and cultural moment, explore the importance of values-based leadership, and call out the failures of transactional mindsets. This episode challenges leaders to hold the line on integrity, even—and especially—when things get tough.
Topics explored in this episode:
(2:46) The Ubiquity of Adversity
* Leaders should expect to face new forms of adversity as they grow their business.
* Adversity can distort one's perception, making challenges seem more overwhelming than they are.
(8:24) The Genesis of a Calling
* How Dave’s bankruptcy led him to discover his calling in helping others manage their finances.
* Helping others through hardship can transform personal struggles into a meaningful career.
(17:24) Developing Resilience
* How previous challenges can build resilience and provide perspective on current difficulties.
* Leaders must work through challenges rather than avoid them.
(22:50) Navigating the Stages of Business
* Dave outlines the five stages of business growth: treadmill, pathfinder, trailblazer, peak performer, and legacy.
* Each stage presents unique challenges and requires different strategies for success and progression.
(31:09) Continuous Learning
* Effective leaders are lifelong learners who integrate insights from various sources and generously credit others.
Thanks to Dave Ramsey for being on the show!
Learn more about Dave and his company Ramsey Solutions: https://www.ramseysolutions.com/
Follow Dave on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ramsey-dave/
Get Dave’s books mentioned in this episode:
* Build a Business You Love: Mastering the Five Stages of Business: https://store.ramseysolutions.com/business-and-career/books/build-a-business-you-love-by-dave-ramsey/
* EntreLeadership: 20 Years of Practical Business Wisdom from the Trenches: https://store.ramseysolutions.com/business-and-career/books/entreleadership/
This episode of At The Table with Patrick Lencioni is brought to you by The Table Group: https://www.tablegroup.com. We teach leaders how to make work more effective and less dysfunctional. We also help their employees be more fulfilled and less miserable.
At The Table is a podcast that lives at the connection between work life, leadership, organizational health, and culture. Subscribe on Apple Podcasts (https://apple.co/4hJKKSL), Spotify (https://spoti.fi/4l1aop0), and YouTube (https://bit.ly/At-The-Table-YouTube).
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Transcript
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| 0:00.0 | So you've got to have something akin to a calling that sustains you. If you're just doing business for money only, you won't make it. You won't make it because it's too hard. Money's not gratifying enough to cause you to fight. |
| 0:18.0 | Welcome to At the Table, the podcast that lives at the connection between work life, culture, organizational health, and leadership. |
| 0:26.4 | And today, for the second time ever, we have a guest host, a very special one. |
| 0:32.3 | Dave Ramsey, a dear friend of mine, everybody knows who Dave Ramsey is. |
| 0:36.7 | I mean, I'm sure he doesn't like this, |
| 0:39.1 | but he's the guru of really managing finances, but far more than that, how to run a company, |
| 0:44.2 | how to be a leader, a dear friend of mine. And Dave, only Craig Groschelle, a friend of yours, |
| 0:49.9 | has also been a co-host with us before. And we've been talking about doing this for years, and we're finally doing it. |
| 0:55.2 | And it's great to have you on. |
| 0:57.1 | Well, I'm honored to be here. |
| 0:58.8 | And if I can do anything that's anywhere near Craig Groschelle, I'm in, let's do it. |
| 1:03.5 | You and me both. |
| 1:05.8 | So, Dave, what we're going to do is rather than just do an interview, because people can find interviews all over the place. |
| 1:11.9 | I want to take apart a topic and give your perspective on that. |
| 1:16.7 | And what we're going to do, we're titling today's podcast Hard Times, which was the title of a book by Charles Dickens. |
| 1:23.6 | It was a hard book to read too. |
| 1:25.7 | But what I want to talk to you about today, something that |
| 1:28.7 | you have in your story, because everybody does, and I love this part of your story, and you help |
| 1:34.4 | people who are also going through hard times. It's how do we as leaders in running an organization |
| 1:39.7 | and being in an organization see the good that comes out of hard times, the necessity of dealing with those things and not let it discourage us. |
| 1:48.3 | Now, I want to say before we get started, |
| 1:49.8 | you have a book that just came out called Build a Business You Love. |
... |
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