Hey there, this is your host, Kamea. I hope you had a restful holiday season and that your start to this new year has been all of the things that you might need during this time.

As we move deeper into 2025, first of all, I'm so excited to share the many conversations we already have in the pipeline for you this season.

So definitely stay tuned

and make sure you're subscribed to my Substack newsletter, which you can find at camilla.substack.com.

And I also just want to share that our call for your direct support continues as well, because

independent media is more important than ever, and every contribution,

no matter how small or large, really helps us out so much. So if you haven't already, we invite

you to join our Patreon or Substack membership or contribute a gift of any amount at

greendreamer.com slash support. If you need a planner for the new year,

you can also check out our fundraising green dreamer planners at green dreamer.com slash shop.

Thank you so, so much for whatever forms of support you're able to share with us.

For now, enjoy the show.

Green Dreamer is supported by our listener patrons, and to be really honest, I can really use your direct support during this time.

Please, of course, do take care of yourself and your loved ones first, but if you are able to become a patron starting at just $2 per month, you can head to greendreamer.com slash support to learn more.

And thank you so, so much to our existing patrons.

It really helps a lot.

Centralized systems that rely on really efficient supply chains

are beautiful works of art,

but they also leave us very vulnerable.

That was Lonnie Grafman, a professor of community-based design at Humboldt State University,

the president of Apropedia Foundation, director of the awesome business competition, and author

of To Catch the Rain. Lonnie is really up to so many incredible projects,

...