This episode was recorded on November 8th, 2021 Andy Ngo is an independent journalist and photographer who lives under constant threats for his reporting and expertise on American Antifa and the militant far-left. He has testified before the U.S. Congress, appeared on countless TV shows, radio programs, and podcasts, and has been featured in the Wall Street Journal, New York Post, Newsweek, Fox News, National Review, and more. Andy is currently the editor-at-large at the Post Millennial. In this episode, I discuss Andy’s experiences with Antifa, race riots, autonomous zones, and the ‘summer of love’ in Seattle. We also exchanged thoughts on the psychology of mob violence, journalistic integrity, dealing with criticism, using people for political ends, attempts to destabilize the police, and lots more. Check out Ngo’s new book https://www.amazon.com/Unmasked-Antifas-Radical-Destroy-Democracy/dp/154605958X/ref=tmm_hrd_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=1643921778&sr=1-2 Take the ‘Understand Myself’ personality questionnaire https://understandmyself.com ___________ Chapters ___________ [00:00] Jordan introduces Andy Ngo [01:10] When Jordan & Andy first met and Jordan's imaginary enemies [02:08] Race riots and the existence of Antifa [04:19] Andy Ngo's experience with Antifa [07:58] The problem with conceptualizing Antifa [14:29] What motivates legacy media to minimize Antifa? [16:08] Was there a time Andy ever thought the stakes were high enough he violated his journalistic integrity? [19:44] How does Andy know he's not exaggerating the threat? [20:53] "They believe that no act they commit can go too far." AN [21:05] "Imagine that you are so virtuous in your pursuits that you are entitled to do anything to anyone whenever you want." JBP [22:19] "It's this moral license that goes along with this claim of virtue that really scares the hell out of, and it's also the fact that you can instantly demonize your enemies because if you're so virtuous that everything is justified, then anyone who opposes you is virtually Satan themselves." JBP [22:43] Story of a Minnesota mob kicking someone's teeth in [25:55] The Psychology of mob violence [27:17] How does he know he's not an exaggerating threat [31:18] Destabilizing the police [31:49] Is it helpful to categorize radicals either left or right? [36:41] The "summer of love" in Seattle [41:07] The gang members who came out at night [41:25] Stories of the autonomous zones [47:04] Instrumentality and using people to achieve a goal [48:04] "We've got to get rid of this idea that we can use people for an end; I don't care what the damn end is." [48:32] How destabilized have these cities become because of this? [51:19] The Minnesota Freedom Fund [52:58] Criticisms of Andy Ngo [54:34] How he knows the Minnesota Freedom Fund wants to abolish the criminal justice system, what are they doing wrong by bailing these people out, and how he knows it linked to an ideology. [56:57] "The system gets sloppy and self-congratulatory as we move toward statements like, the system is broken." [58:21] What do we do about the large incrimination of Americans, including a disproportionate number of them African Americans? [01:03:05] Wading through the accusations of the freedom fund being far left and Andy being far-right [01:04:33] James O'Keefe and Project Veritas [01:06:32] Andy's connection to Portland's militant right-wing and far-right-wing groups. [01:12:38] How many times he's been beaten up and why he kept going on. [01:18:52] Minnesota Freedom Fund cont. Who are they getting out on bail, and why do they think it's a good idea? [01:24:08] Jordan refers to a part of Andy's book that addresses a comment made by Kamala Harris