Huh. Have you ever wondered what a sandwich sounds like?

Not much to it, is there?

Unless, of course, it's a Walker's sandwich.

Mmm, that is good.

Now that's what Asani should sound like.

Go all crisp in with walkers.

Delicious.

Hi there, I'm Jason Gatz, and you're listening to Think Again, a Big Think podcast.

The first computer I ever had was the Apple Macintosh back in the mid-80s.

I can still remember the sense of friendly reassurance from that smiling little icon that popped up on the screen when you turned it on, a cute, tiny computer smiling back at you.

This device, it suggested, knew you, understood you, was someone you could trust.

Since then, we've come a long way, baby. The cold black, addictive rectangle in my pocket, a gleaming window into all the hopes and

terrors of the known world, is a far cry from the early, friendly promises of that smiling

machine on which I could magically paint things at the touch of a button.

My guest today, in a very different way, grew up in the long shadow of that same cultural

trajectory.

Steve Jobs, the founder of Apple, was her dad. But like our relationship

with the machines, he helped unleash on the world. Hers with him was deeply complicated.

In Lisa Brennan Jobs' beautiful memoir, Small Fry, she writes about his indifference, his attention,

and her struggle to find herself in and outside of his shadow.

Welcome to think again, Lisa.

Thank you so much for having me.

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